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Post by Dubsounds on Jul 9, 2008 9:28:28 GMT
I see it like this:
At least someone has the balls to have a go!
Modelling a Polymoog is probably the most difficult project I could imagine anyone undertaking. I believe the difference between this and other soft synths is that Clinton has based his design on his own virtual paraphonic/divider circuitry, (from the work he's already done for recreating the ARP Quadra).
It still might not be possible… but if he CAN do it and I can help him by providing the comparisons to the real thing then that's a good thing… Isn't it?
Adam has a tendency to get carried away but it should be noted that his enthusiasm kicked this all off in the first place.
Of course it doesn't sound like Vox Humana yet, those of us that are close to the sound can hear this and perhaps it's a bad idea putting anything up at all until it does.
I can see that a lot of people would have EXTREMELY high expectations for something like this and judging from the feedback I'm getting, (publicly and privately) this is creating mixed feelings from...
"It sounds nothing like VH, therefore why are you wasting your time"?
to...
"OMG I just had a multiple orgasm".
Let's all calm down a little eh?
I'm very mindful of what Kevin Lightner said about VSTi recreations of classic synths in that he had never heard one that sounded like the real thing. A guy like Kevin would know because he's spent the majority of his life surrounded by "the real thing".
Unfortunately, for most of the musical world these days, "real things" are now an eccentric and space consuming indulgence. The majority of keyboard players are using VST's so we have to embrace them whether we like them or not.
Ten years from now, a VST will be the nearest most people will ever get to a Polymoog (unfortunately)…
Now fuck off... I'm busy ;D
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Post by vortex on Jul 9, 2008 9:56:56 GMT
I see it like this: At least someone has the balls to have a go! Modelling a Polymoog is probably the most difficult project I could imagine anyone undertaking. I believe the difference between this and other soft synths is that Clinton has based his design on his own virtual paraphonic/divider circuitry, (from the work he's already done for recreating the ARP Quadra). It still might not be possible… but if he CAN do it and I can help him by providing the comparisons to the real thing then that's a good thing… Isn't it? Adam has a tendency to get carried away but it should be noted that his enthusiasm kicked this all off in the first place. Of course it doesn't sound like Vox Humana yet, those of us that are close to the sound can hear this and perhaps it's a bad idea putting anything up at all until it does. I can see that a lot of people would have EXTREMELY high expectations for something like this and judging from the feedback I'm getting, (publicly and privately) this is creating mixed feelings from... "It sounds nothing like VH, therefore why are you wasting your time"? to... "OMG I just had a multiple orgasm". Let's all calm down a little eh? I'm very mindful of what Kevin Lightner said about VSTi recreations of classic synths in that he had never heard one that sounded like the real thing. A guy like Kevin would know because he's spent the majority of his life surrounded by "the real thing". Unfortunately, for most of the musical world these days, "real things" are now an eccentric and space consuming indulgence. The majority of keyboard players are using VST's so we have to embrace them whether we like them or not. Ten years from now, a VST will be the nearest most people will ever get to a Polymoog (unfortunately)… Now fuck off... I'm busy ;D Now hang on a minute. 2 things will scupper this project 1 False praise/flattery 2 The emperors new coat syndrome ie failing to aknowledge the visible/audible truth Far be it from me to piss on any bonfires and I would like to go on record as praising Adams "fuck you who say it can't be done, I'm going to do something"philosphy and Clintons programing brilliance. BUT its not right yet and there has been no public hint that such feedback is getting to the movers and shakers. since when did dubsounds censor feedback. Which has been deafening only by its silence thus far. Anyway I sense I have mounted my high horse again so I'm going to cool off. I too have had a busy day and have had to take many hits for the team for problems that were not of my making. As such it has left me spoiling for a fight
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Post by Dubsounds on Jul 9, 2008 10:44:27 GMT
since when did dubsounds censor feedback. Which has been deafening only by its silence thus far Joe, it may not have been apparent but my post was my little speech on things as I see them and not a direct response to your prior post. I'm not censoring any feedback. I'm not asking for any either. I don't think the project should be heard until it's ready and THEN it can be open to all the feedback you can throw at it. Adam posting up a very imperfect Replicas with wild claims is not helping, (sorry Adam). People will immediately judge the thing on that clip alone and naturally think this is a waste of time. As I see it, it's a bit pointless seeking an opinion on a cake that hasn't been baked just by running their finger round the mixing bowl. And no I'm not being rude but I really AM busy....
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Post by Polymoog Lover on Jul 9, 2008 18:27:28 GMT
Wild claims!? I'm sorry guys, i didn't know i was being a dick about it, it's just that... i have no way of getting a Polymoog, and having wanted one for 3 years now, this is just getting me so excited!
If i am "getting on anyones tits" about things, PLEASE TELL ME.
As for Vox Humana, !I! FUCKED IT UP!!! Not Clinton, probably not the VST, ME. I was fiddling with it and (being a neurotic motha-fucka) thought "This is excellent.... let's make it better!". It started with running the Resonator over the Lower end (good) and then brightening up the top end (questionable) and then fuckin' with the Vibrato Depths and speeds (major fuck-up).
I apologize, PROFUSELY. If it's any consolation, i should let you all know that i have Asperger's Syndrome and in my case, when i'm really excited about something, i tend to exaggerate a bit.
I am deeply embarrassed at my pseudo-village-idiot fucko act, but.... well... i'm just sorry.
I hope this didn't turn anyone off to this VST, because that is the complete antithesis of what i am trying to do here. I'm just hocking for a great VST in the works.
I will try to curb my enthusiasm.
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Post by Minimoog on Jul 9, 2008 19:49:55 GMT
I will try to curb my enthusiasm. Nowt wrong with a bit of enthusiasm lad, makes a change from the world-weary cynicism I specialise in
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Post by vortex on Jul 9, 2008 19:51:20 GMT
;DAdam you're ok with me mate ;D
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Post by magiccrumb on Jul 9, 2008 20:22:43 GMT
I will try to curb my enthusiasm. No, don't do that. Thanks to you and Clinton we are now closer than ever to a VSTi. Fantastic. Personally, I've sold almost all of my old gear. I don't give a shit about vintage this and super fabulous filters that. Blah blah. I sold my minimoog for 10 times what I paid for it. My moog prodigy was sold for 8 times what it cost me. Sold my Roland system 100 for double what I paid. I'm VSTi all the way now. Yes, I know, they sound nothing like the real things but who gives a shit? Unless you do a direct A/B comparison it is hard to tell with most emulations I made my living in the early 90s with a Roland S-550 sampler, minimoog and an Oscar. The number of times the Oscar would just pack up and stop working. Usually, a room full of suits would come down to the studio to see their jingle being made and the Oscar would just make a high pitched whining sound and sit there with all the LED's on steady. This after working perfectly for weeks before hand. All the synth engineers at the time knew me and my Oscar. One day I rang a guy who had fixed it 3 times and before I could say anything he just said, "Sorry, I'm not touching it. I'll send you the circuit diagrams for free. Good Luck." What a piece of shit. Nowadays, I hear everyone talk about it like it's a classic. To some it may be, but to me the Oscar is a piece of shit and I'm glad I'll never have to touch one ever again. My point being that Vintage classic gear will always be the best for some people but for others it won't be. I don't care if a VST is nothing like the original. If it comes close, I'm really happy. I've always wanted the Vox Humana sound and I used to think I'd love to buy a real Polymoog but thinking about this now....nah! For me, it's just not worth the money and the drama. I'll just have the Vox Humana sound emulated, someone else can have the real polymoog. Just my view. I know better than anyone that the real thing is always a better sound. But with all the costs and bullshit considered, is it worth it? For some, yes, absolutely. For me, no. No way. I was talking to Vince Clarke quite some years ago. When everything was Midi, he said he would never ever go to Midi. He laughed at it, thought it was complete shit. He always thought his real analogue gear could never be sold/replaced. Of course, now to my knowledge, he uses midi and virtual instruments. I recently saw he was auctioning off a lot of old gear on ebay. This guy was THE analogue synth guy. He had everything. Even he saw the light eventually. Clinton, when that Polymoog VSTi is ready, I'll gladly purchase it and if it sounds close to Vox Humana but not quite, I'll still be damn pleased. I'll take it in whatever form it comes in and thanks for doing it. ;D Hurrah!!! Shaun, I've got my cash in my hand for your CR-78 library when ready.
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Post by Minimoog on Jul 9, 2008 21:49:53 GMT
A beautifully crafted post MC - I can't disagree with a word you've said.
;D
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Post by Polymoog Lover on Jul 9, 2008 22:35:46 GMT
Interesting, I've never thought about it that way before.... I mean, i know the bullshit you have to go through to get the REAL Analog sound (tuning instability, repair difficulty, memory problems, etc.) but i never envisioned someone to ditch the Analog as a whole just for that reason.
The OSCar was completely Digital minus the Filter, i don't know why THAT particular piece of gear would be shitting the bed on you, but whatever....
err, I hope this Polymoog is realistic... up until now i thought it was the prick AND balls, but after what Shaun, Minimoog, and you have said, i'm going to half to take a step back, take it all in, take a deep breath and say "Fuck it! Gimme' ma' Poly'!"
Maybe you're right, who can tell the difference unless you're doing an A-B comparison. + I don't think people who here one of my recordings say "DAT SOUNDS LIKA' POLYMOOG!!!! But let me get my real one just to make sure!" I don't think anyone would be that.... OCD...
Hell, this is as close as i can get to the glorious sound of a Polymoog, i'd say i'm 90% there, maybe a little less. But no one will know.....
Mwah! ha ha ha ha!.......................Ha!
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Post by overstate2007 on Jul 11, 2008 0:25:49 GMT
Clinton, when that Polymoog VSTi is ready, I'll gladly purchase it and if it sounds close to Vox Humana but not quite, I'll still be damn pleased. I'll take it in whatever form it comes in and thanks for doing it. ;D There should be more people like you around.
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Post by Polymoog Lover on Jul 11, 2008 0:51:28 GMT
Amen
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Post by overstate2007 on Jul 11, 2008 23:04:49 GMT
The VSTi is moving along nicely. I've successfully implemented the VERY esoteric preset/variable switching system on the now fully rendered GUI side.
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Post by Polymoog Lover on Jul 11, 2008 23:06:53 GMT
Yes! Yeeees! ...wait, does this mean it's close to being finished?
Fucking Epic!
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Post by overstate2007 on Jul 12, 2008 19:45:54 GMT
Infact it is near finished. Now it's down to a conference about what we'll replace the factory voices with.
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Post by magiccrumb on Jul 12, 2008 19:57:52 GMT
oooooooooh I'm excited
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Post by Polymoog Lover on Jul 12, 2008 20:43:10 GMT
I'll take it the way it is, mate. I love those factory patches, sooo 1975! If you want, send it to me. But if so, leave the presets alone please
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Post by Polymoog Lover on Jul 13, 2008 17:16:24 GMT
You know what i just thought of? Chris Roberson. Working feverishly on his recreation of a Polymoog! He's gonna come back to this forum all like "Hey guys, my Polymoog is fi-" and he's gonna see Overstate2007's PM and shit a Klondike bar! He'll think to himself, "That Mother-Fucker." and "All this work for shit." I sincerely hope he doesn't shoot up a post office in a fit of rage and denial. In our defense however, he never updated us as to how the project was going or any of that stuff, so it would only seem logical that if someone came here with a 60% complete Polymoog and offered to continue it, that we would accept. *Sigh* What is I gonna do' After all, it was ME that told him to make it in the first pla- I'VE GOT IT! I'll buy both! Not only that, i'm sure we're not the only ones who want a PM vst, others will buy from him! Maybe i should Email him and apologize for fuckin' up.
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Post by overstate2007 on Jul 13, 2008 17:43:56 GMT
I haven't done the presets yet. I've made basic versions of them, but I still need to plug them into the preset panel which takes time. I'm waiting on that until I can be sure exactly how the machine responds and how the patches are set up. So many of them seem to use similar stuff....
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Post by Polymoog Lover on Jul 13, 2008 18:07:36 GMT
eeer! Can't wait! Keep up the good work, my friend!
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Post by overstate2007 on Jul 17, 2008 15:34:32 GMT
Anyone hear from Shaun?
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