Mind - New track & Online Collaboration

[dlm21uk]

Hi guys. I've been fiddling away and thought I'd post this in for comments. I originaly played a small snippet of this under the thread called "Comments?" but here is the more complete track.

www.dannymoog.co.uk/MIND.wma

Any comments would be appreciated. ;D

Technical bits :

Main drums done via Orion using Shauns DMX samples, and a mixture of other modified drum sounds.

Fast and slower Kraftwerk style basslines done via Orion using Albino (modified presets with Dannymoog tweekies )

Main string lines made from Polymoog with reverb and phase effects mixed in.

All other basslines, lead sounds and blips created with the yamaha CS15 (adding reverb and flange to some parts)

Ive really tried to use EQ's, panning and effects to bring out the sounds and create a better feel, but I've fiddled for so long that even my own ears are punch drunk

Hope you enjoy it, but any comments welcome all the same. ;D

[Minimoog]

I hate to say it, but it may be possible to hear too much MXRed Polymoog Certainly it's a bit too forward in the mix. There's that great moment around 1:15 when it all kicks in but the Poly comes barging in just as it's getting going and drowns it all out.

The choon doesn't really go anywhere, but as an overall sound it's deffo got potential. Work on that bit between 1:15 - 1:50 and bring the other bits in to support it. Er, perhaps

;D

[Dubsounds]

Danny, I would sooner mix this and add / remove a few bits that sit here for hours typing.

Suffice to say, this has the "potential" to be the best thing you've done so far but some of it needs another set of ears now from the sound of it so I'm volunteering.

Can you let me have the Audition and Orion files? I'll need everything because I'll probably make a lot of changes to the arrangement.

When you get back what I've done, you can proceed further yourself and let it evolve from there.

[dlm21uk]

Sounds FAB ! Shaun. I'm sending you the Adobe and Orion files via email and will send a link to download the extra live recordings (too big for email)

Thanks a million - I'll look forward to seeing what you make of it

;D ;D ;D

[Dubsounds]

JP4 on the case as I type ;D

[secretagent]

Sounds really clean and polished

I agree with jordan about the polymoog overkill,as joe pointed out,i'm also having that problem.

But it sounds SO good and fits the bill everytime.i'm working on something at the moment that i have completely removed all traces of the polymoog to see if i can live without it

Looking forward to hearing shauns input

[Dubsounds]

The way it's looking at the moment (from Danny's arrangement) is that the Polies build up layer after layer. Several of them (no-offence) are redundant and if I let them come in one-by-one in the later half of the song (giving the CS-15 centre stage in the first half) they sound much better in a "cars" layer build up fashion.

Danny also has three bass sequences, two of which aren't really basslines but rhythm sequences (arps) and with tweaking, fill out the traditional area for a rhythm guitar.

What surprises me is that the third arp is a killer hook and needs to be ripped out of its lonely second half 4 bar appearance and made a feature.

Some of the percussion sounds such as the numan cars crash are triggered in the wrong place (think Roland Drum grid, Danny had them at 9... they actually sound correct at 13, the place for the second snare). Also the quijada got on my tits right away when I first heard Danny's clip above. I knew then that it would be better to use it on 5 only and not 5 and 13 of every bar. Do you see what happens here? Quij' gets 5 / Crash gets 13. Making spaces, that's what it’s all about.

The main bassline you hear first was just a single note arp. I've now dropped that an octave and added a fifth above to get the thing leaping a bit.

The final thing (and this would normally be a pain in the ass is that I found the song to be too ploddy at 102 BPM and have pushed it to 108 where it start to pick up a toe-tap). I say a pain because Danny's live synths are already recorded at 102. In this instance, I will time stretch his live CS-15 (and if it's shit, he can re-record it) and the Polymoog parts I will re-do here.

The song needs a decent low sub bass pulse so I'll add something there and apart from that, a gratuitous few layers of JP 4 wouldn't go amiss for my contribution.

Once I have all that sorted, I'll get to work making more space in the thing so sounds can get a breathing space and have their on "show off" bits and pull stuff out and re-arrange it. For instance... making use of that hooky arp I talked about (it should be an intro as well). I'd also like to add more musical variation because at the moment the song element of this track is really just three descending notes and could do with some variation and maybe some additional areas that could serve as a bridge, mid 8 etc.

Once again, no offence to Danny but this could be seen as a classic case of rushing ahead and over-producing before there is a discernable song. Admittedly, it is this production that got me excited about Dan's track but the more you work on it, the more you see the padding

What might be fun (if Dan is in agreement) is if we turn this into another Forum jam once I've had my wicked way with the material. I can upload the backing track and ask you lot if you want to add anything from bass guitar to Korg shiton to Tibetan nose flutes. You can all play with it and add things. Send me back your overdubs which I can mangle back into the multi-track.

How does that sound?

[dlm21uk]

Sounds bloody great mate

The jam idea also sounds like fun if others are up for it.
It would also be very interesting for me to see what difference there is in the ideas I get/or have for the track, as apposed to what ideas other people hear/get.

We could end up with two completely different songs based on the same starting point.

There was a thought behind my limited notes on the track (honest ). The main parts are C A F# descending, & the middle part is C A# G descending. I decided to try and make a track that has lots of over-tunes in it but was based on only 3 notes (with a slight change in the middle). But I agree that it would be hard to stretch that out anymore and if it is to sound more of a complete song, it should have more variation in the route notes. ;D

Thanks so much for all your work on this so far Shaun, your changes sound very exciting already ;D

[spoonz]

I think it's crying out for and Oddy scream or a big Filter sweep in the back ground.
The lower Polymoog worked for me but not the higher notes.
That needs a different instrument to give some variation.

[Dubsounds]

spoonz said:

I think it's crying out for and Oddy scream or a big Filter sweep in the back ground.

Well you know that orgasmic filter sweep I patched up on my JP4 Colin? Well that's what I have in mind. I also will be adding a booooming sub bass as well.

But for now...

HERE is the first re-work of Danny's Sequenced material.

As I said, I'm going to do a sub bass and filter sweep on my Jup but anyone (Colin?) who fancies doing some screamer odyssey, guitar, vocals, icecream van, christmas carols, stylophone, tuba or whatever over the top - use this as your backing track.

Overdub what you want and send it to me on a 192kbit mp3 with the original backing panned hard left and your additional stuff panned hard right. Don't worry about stereo. If you're using ultra-wide stereo effects on it, you've already gone a step too far

DANNY!!!

Mate Can you pick up the new SFS file from your email and stream it (whole song) and plop it in Audition and use that as a new guide and... re-do your CS-15 and Polymoog overdubs again at the new tempo, then send the new wavs and SES file back to me pretty please?

Sorry but the tempo change has made your old takes unusable #nobody#

[spoonz]

The Oddy is still waiting parts so no can do at the mo

[dlm21uk]

Shaun ! That is the dogs nuts ! infact it is better than the dogs nuts . . .

IT'S BLOODY GREAT !

;D #banana# #guitman01#

[Dubsounds]

spoonz said:

The Oddy is still waiting parts so no can do at the mo

Can't you use something else Col? As I said to Danny on the phone just now, there's no point in turning a chocolate cake into a cheese souffle but lets get this collab kicking mate ;D

[lemonkid1]

Nice one. ;D The overall vibe so far reminds me a lot of "Blancmange", and those Polymoog melodys in the first version are excellent, I'd have those "Cars crash" parts nice and loud in the mix as well

[Dubsounds]

lemonkid1 said:

I'd have those "Cars crash" parts nice and loud in the mix as well

Less is more lemmo, less is more

[rpb1966]

I do like the way this is developing guys, I`m looking forward to the end result. ;D

[Dubsounds]

So you won't be contributing anything then Russ?

[spoonz]

admin said:

spoonz said:

The Oddy is still waiting parts so no can do at the mo

Can't you use something else Col? As I said to Danny on the phone just now, there's no point in turning a chocolate cake into a cheese souffle but lets get this collab kicking mate ;D

Working on it

[rpb1966]

admin said:

So you won't be contributing anything then Russ?

Do you really want something from an arse biscuit mate?. I`ve no Polymoog, no Mini, no ARP, and no fookin CP-30 #nobody#

[Dubsounds]

Considering the backing track is mostly Albino 3 Russ, I hardly think anyone could say no to a drop of arse biscuit